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David Raymond Amos @DavidRayAmos
Replying to @DavidRayAmos@Kathryn98967631 and 49 others
https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2020/01/want-to-understand-hydro-quebecs.html
#nbpoli#cdnpoli
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/hydro-quebec-mactaquac-analysis-1.5432123
But a third deal, a promise to look at building new transmission links, is the real breakthrough for the Quebec utility, analysts say.
Hydro-Québec has more electricity than residents of that province can use. It built four new large dams over the last 11 years, leaving it with an unexpected supply of excess electricity it must sell to avoid the dams becoming white elephants.
"We have both new supply of electricity, and the demand in Quebec for the last 10 years mostly remained stable," says Pierre-Olivier Pineau, the research chair in energy sector management at HEC Montreal, a graduate-level business university.
"There's a lot of water in Hydro-Québec's reservoirs."
New Brunswick represents a convenient nearby buyer for that cheap, clean electricity, but also a potential path to even larger, more lucrative markets.
NB Power has two transmission connections to Maine it already uses to sell power into New England, and there's enough room on those lines to carry more electricity, from here or from Quebec, than is being exported now.
For Jack Keir, the former Liberal energy minister who promoted the 2009 sale agreement to a reluctant public, the same logic underlying that deal is driving the new negotiations.
"I believed in 2009 when we started looking at it, as I do today, [that] it's the right thing to do that we get our electricity as cheaply as we can, and that New Brunswick is located in the perfect spot to feed all of Atlantic Canada and the northeastern United States," he said.
Jack Keir, the former Liberal energy minister, said he sees the same logic in this deal as was in a 2009 failed deal to sell NB Power outright to Hydro-Québec.
Three of the massive dams have gone into service in the past five years. A fourth begins operating next year.
They were approved when energy prices were high and demand within Quebec was expected to grow. But prices are down and demand in the province has flatlined.
"We've plateaued," Martel told the Financial Post in 2018. "This is putting a lot of pressure on our financials."
The solution: more exports.
"At this point Hydro-Québec is pursuing export projects in all directions, to Ontario, to New York, to New England and all the Atlantic provinces," Pineau said.
But Keir believes the strategic ambition that drove Hydro-Québec's attempt to buy NB Power 10 years ago is at work again now.
"We're a straight line for them down to New England," Keir said.
Keir still defends that sale agreement, arguing New Brunswick would have acquired more benefits from it than what's on the table now: the elimination of $5 billion in NB Power debt; the cost of refurbishing Mactaquac taken on by Hydro-Québec, and power rates reduced for industry and frozen for residents.
That wasn't enough to win over New Brunswickers, who mostly opposed the sale.
"Because we've already been through this once, it's somewhat less shocking the second time, and frankly, let's be honest here: they're not selling anything, so folks aren't as passionate," Keir said.
"Back then folks really believed we were giving up our sovereignty and a huge asset that we had. It was very difficult to convince folks otherwise. Now that's not even an argument coming into play here."
There have been other major shifts since a decade ago, the largest being climate change emerging as a major policy priority.
Ottawa has new regulations to limit carbon emissions and "we have to comply," said Louise Comeau, director of the Environment and Sustainable Development Research Centre at the University of New Brunswick.
The Quebec-New Brunswick deal could be a forerunner of a broader plan to integrate five provincial grids, allowing hydro dams in Quebec and Labrador to displace coal and fuel oil as a source of electricity generation, she said.
"Why don't we work together on a plan, a complete plan to serve 100 per cent of clean energy to all our provinces?" Quebec Premier Francois Legault said last week.
While New Brunswick is looking to sign an equivalency agreement with Ottawa that would allow NB Power's Belledune power plant to continue using some coal past a 2030 federal phase-out, Premier Blaine Higgs raised the possibility the plant could close.
Keir said the discussion about Belledune is more muted than it was in 2009, a sign of climate change becoming a bigger concern.
There are still major questions about all the potential integration.
Keir points out Quebec would have to bid to use any new transmission line capacity in New Brunswick.
"It can't just be given to Quebec unless they change that legislation."
David Raymond Amos @DavidRayAmos
Replying to @DavidRayAmos@Kathryn98967631 and 49 others
https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2020/01/want-to-understand-hydro-quebecs.html
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/hydro-quebec-mactaquac-analysis-1.5432123
Want to understand Hydro-Québec's Mactaquac plan? Look south of the border
While Quebec will sell more energy to New Brunswick, New England may be the real target
But a third deal, a promise to look at building new transmission links, is the real breakthrough for the Quebec utility, analysts say.
"We have both new supply of electricity, and the demand in Quebec for the last 10 years mostly remained stable," says Pierre-Olivier Pineau, the research chair in energy sector management at HEC Montreal, a graduate-level business university.
"There's a lot of water in Hydro-Québec's reservoirs."
Going to America?
New Brunswick represents a convenient nearby buyer for that cheap, clean electricity, but also a potential path to even larger, more lucrative markets.
NB Power has two transmission connections to Maine it already uses to sell power into New England, and there's enough room on those lines to carry more electricity, from here or from Quebec, than is being exported now.
For Jack Keir, the former Liberal energy minister who promoted the 2009 sale agreement to a reluctant public, the same logic underlying that deal is driving the new negotiations.
"I believed in 2009 when we started looking at it, as I do today, [that] it's the right thing to do that we get our electricity as cheaply as we can, and that New Brunswick is located in the perfect spot to feed all of Atlantic Canada and the northeastern United States," he said.
Jack Keir, the former Liberal energy minister, said he sees the same logic in this deal as was in a 2009 failed deal to sell NB Power outright to Hydro-Québec.
High supply, stagnant demand
Three of the massive dams have gone into service in the past five years. A fourth begins operating next year.
They were approved when energy prices were high and demand within Quebec was expected to grow. But prices are down and demand in the province has flatlined.
"We've plateaued," Martel told the Financial Post in 2018. "This is putting a lot of pressure on our financials."
The solution: more exports.
"At this point Hydro-Québec is pursuing export projects in all directions, to Ontario, to New York, to New England and all the Atlantic provinces," Pineau said.
Defending dead deals
But Keir believes the strategic ambition that drove Hydro-Québec's attempt to buy NB Power 10 years ago is at work again now.
"We're a straight line for them down to New England," Keir said.
Keir still defends that sale agreement, arguing New Brunswick would have acquired more benefits from it than what's on the table now: the elimination of $5 billion in NB Power debt; the cost of refurbishing Mactaquac taken on by Hydro-Québec, and power rates reduced for industry and frozen for residents.
That wasn't enough to win over New Brunswickers, who mostly opposed the sale.
At this point Hydro-Québec is pursuing export projects in all directions, to Ontario, to New York, to New England and all the Atlantic provinces.
- Pierre-Olivier PineauThis time, Hydro-Québec's incursion hasn't stirred nearly the same emotions.
"Because we've already been through this once, it's somewhat less shocking the second time, and frankly, let's be honest here: they're not selling anything, so folks aren't as passionate," Keir said.
"Back then folks really believed we were giving up our sovereignty and a huge asset that we had. It was very difficult to convince folks otherwise. Now that's not even an argument coming into play here."
There have been other major shifts since a decade ago, the largest being climate change emerging as a major policy priority.
The green dimension
Ottawa has new regulations to limit carbon emissions and "we have to comply," said Louise Comeau, director of the Environment and Sustainable Development Research Centre at the University of New Brunswick.
The Quebec-New Brunswick deal could be a forerunner of a broader plan to integrate five provincial grids, allowing hydro dams in Quebec and Labrador to displace coal and fuel oil as a source of electricity generation, she said.
"Why don't we work together on a plan, a complete plan to serve 100 per cent of clean energy to all our provinces?" Quebec Premier Francois Legault said last week.
While New Brunswick is looking to sign an equivalency agreement with Ottawa that would allow NB Power's Belledune power plant to continue using some coal past a 2030 federal phase-out, Premier Blaine Higgs raised the possibility the plant could close.
Keir said the discussion about Belledune is more muted than it was in 2009, a sign of climate change becoming a bigger concern.
Questions remain
There are still major questions about all the potential integration.
Keir points out Quebec would have to bid to use any new transmission line capacity in New Brunswick.
"It can't just be given to Quebec unless they change that legislation."
About the Author
Jacques Poitras has been CBC's provincial affairs reporter in New Brunswick since 2000. Raised in Moncton, he also produces the CBC political podcast Spin Reduxit.
42 Comments
Reply to @David Raymond Amos: Methinks some of Minister Mikey's minions must recall the NB-NBSO-NERC MOU that Jacky Boy Keir signed On Oct 3rd, 2008 if not not the EUB and Neil Jacobsen now working for Atlantica certainly should N'esy Pas?
David Peters
Reply to @Jacques poirier:
...but, Mactaquac Dam is failing because of concrete that came from Quebec.
...but, Mactaquac Dam is failing because of concrete that came from Quebec.
Kyle Woodman
Reply to @David Peters: That's not true in the least.
David Peters
Reply to @Kyle Woodman:
Mactaquac dam was made from the same concrete as Olympic Stadium...and it failed in exactly the same way...or is history being re-written?
Mactaquac dam was made from the same concrete as Olympic Stadium...and it failed in exactly the same way...or is history being re-written?
David Raymond Amos
Reply to @David Peters: Not the same concrete unless they trucked a mountain of our gravel to Quebec to make. However methinks it was the same cement because it did come from Quebec and nobody has denied it N'esy Pas?
David Peters
Reply to @David Raymond Amos:
...as long as, going forward, NB doesn't forget Quebec's involvement in the building of the prematurely failing Mactaquac dam...and the one-sided Churchill Falls agreement where Quebec receives $30 for every Nfld's $1.
...as long as, going forward, NB doesn't forget Quebec's involvement in the building of the prematurely failing Mactaquac dam...and the one-sided Churchill Falls agreement where Quebec receives $30 for every Nfld's $1.
David Peters
Reply to @David Raymond Amos:
...and the fact that that crazy, one-sided 'agreement' was signed on for decades.
...and the fact that that crazy, one-sided 'agreement' was signed on for decades.
David Raymond Amos
Reply to @Kyle Woodman: I doubt it NB Power clammed up about that plan pretty quickly ate the EUB hearing last year However thus far everyone has failed to understand what I know about Quebec, Maine, New Hampshshire, Vermont, Massachusetts and the Maritimes but methinks Franky Boy McKenna, the "Powers That Be" in NB and everywhere else certainly do N'esy Pas?