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David Raymond Amos @DavidRayAmos
Replying to @DavidRayAmos@Kathryn98967631 and 48 others
Methinks Minister Mikey Holland's ears are burning right now or my name ain't "Just Dave" Anyone can Google "Harper and Bankers" if they don't get my jokes about the circus in Fredericton and Ottawa N'esy Pas?
https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2019/05/nb-power-reviving-vexed-smart-meter.html
#cdnpoli#nbpoli
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/nb-power-smart-meter-application-eub-1.5156867
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54 Comments
Mark (Junkman) George
Content disabled
Screwed enough money out of us to gamble $13 million, and now looking for more?
David Amos
Mark (Junkman) George
Like hogs feeding at the trough............
The EUB beats those hogs away from the trough, but they are right back trying suck up some more out of us.
David Amos
David Amos
Surprise Surprise Surprise
David Amos
David Amos
Methinks the EUB agrees with me in that the 357 Matter should be settled firsst before NB Power makes another stab and getting Smart Matters N'esy Pas?
These documents can be sourced from the records of the 375 Matter Day 1 of the very long hearing was 02/07/2018
http://www.nbeub.ca/opt/M/browserecord.php?-action=browse&-recid=560
02/09/2018 Hearing - Day 3
Page 601
VICE-CHAIRMAN: I was a bit surprised when I heard this morning and
yesterday that you are entering into a contract at the end of February
and is that with respect to the purchase of the smart meters?
MS. CLARK: That's correct.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: So how can you enter into a contract without the
firm approval of this Board, if we are going to approve or not the
AMI? How prudent is that?
MS. CLARK: So we are at the end stages of the contract in terms of
just the final terms and conditions, but we have been very clear that
we -- with the vendor -- and they recognize that, because we also have
Nova Scotia Power, who is part of our consortium, who also needs Board
approval. So should we not get -- this is conditional on EUB
approval. So should we not get EUB approval, the contract would not
proceed.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Now there was discussion yesterday, I think it was
with Mr. Stoll regarding time of use and time based pricing, and so I
went through the evidence this morning, and in your main evidence, and
I think one of the objective of having the AMI going forward to a time
of use price structure -- rate structure. So am I understanding that
correctly?
David Amos
Alex Butt
Yet another way for Mr thomas to make more money for himself and his merry band! When will NB wake up and force the government to put an end to this insanity!
David Amos
David Amos
Methinks Minister Mikey Holland's ears are burning right now or my name ain't "Just Dave" Anyone can Google "Harper and Bankers" if they don't get my joke about the circuses in Fat Fred City and Ottawa N'esy Pas?
Jonas Smith
I wouldn't trust NB Power to correctly cost out a grocery list, let alone believe them that they messed up the first time around.
David Amos
Allan J Whitney
They will not stop until NB Power has been sold at ten cents on the dollar to a syndicate of their pals. This will probably happen soon after the coming Gaetan Thomas investment disaster.
David Amos
John Valcourt
NB Power should not be allowed to put these in where New Brunswickers DONT WANT THEM. That corporation is owned by the government which means it is owned by tax payers and we should have the say. This is just another way for them to charge more than we can afford for the electricity that we need. There is no way this will save New Brunswickers money. Corporations like this don't try to save us money, they try to bleed every last cent out of us. It has to stop NOW.
David Amos
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/eub-hearings-nb-power-smart-meters-1.4529640
Opting out smart meter program could cost NB Power customers
Power customers in British Columbia, Quebec have faced fees for refusing the installation of smart meters
Robert Jones · CBC News · Posted: Feb 10, 2018 8:00 AM AT
"NB Power customers who do not want a smart meter installed on their home could be facing a stiff fee for that decision, but so far the utility is not saying how much it might be.
"It will be based on the principles of cost causation, but we have not gotten into the detail of what that fee would be at this point," said NB Power Senior Vice President of Operations Lori Clark at Energy and Utilities Board hearings on Friday."
Richard Dunn
There have been more than enough reasons to terminate, or not renew, the contract of Gaetan Thomas. NB Power may have a future, but not under his leadership. Please make the necessary changes now.
David Amos
Shawn Tabor
If this is agreed upon, it will be proof in the pudding, that something is very wrong at the top.
David Amos
Trevis L. Kingston
NB Power doesn't need smarter meters... but smarter management and plans.
David Amos
Dave Ess
How are these idiots still in charge of the utility?
Their first application demonstrated that it would cost more than it would give.
Then they dump a pile of money into unproven scientific hype
Then they're entitled to do it all over again?
I might sound paranoid but I can't see how the new smart meter application won't just be a bunch of cooked numbers to show a "benefit" to the consumer but the reality will be increased rates and revenues to offset the the idiot decision to dump $13 million into cold fusion hype.
David Amos
Danny Debdee
Reply to @dave ess: it’s not cold fusion. they didn’t put 13 million into it, they put 6.5 from a research and development fund, which is exactly what it is for and government matched the other 6.5
Danny Debdee
Roger Richard
« During hearings in February 2018, NB Power tried to amend its calculations to boost the benefits of adopting the technology while NB Power president GaëtanThomas gave interviews urging its approval. »
It is worrisome that KPMG is the auditor of NB Power... https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/cra-kmpg-settlement-taxes-1.5154610?__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar&fbclid=IwAR2ZnrhWe_JR6AmwAqt4VcO7BSDTnwmtQQVtZoTd30jtrbQzWQ27m0mBZPg
David Amos
Reply to @Roger Richard: Here is a little Deja Vu for you and the folks to enjoy
Matter 430
IN THE MATTER OF an application by New Brunswick Power Corporation for approval of the schedules of the rates for the fiscal year commencing April 1, 2019, and other relief as outlined in NB Power’s application
Held at the Algonquin Hotel, St. Andrews, N.B., on May 21st 2019.
Page253
Q. - So Mr. Murphy, just so we are clear then, this annual filing that you are envisioning as part of your DSM deferral account process would not involve a prudency review of those expenses per se, would not ever involve an application to change the ten year deferral period -- or ten year amortization period, excuse me. If those two matters were to become before the Board, it would not be part of this annual compliance filing?
MR. MURPHY: That is correct.
MR. STEWART: Thank you. Those are my questions for this panel, Mr. Chair.
CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Stewart.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Dr. Richard, avez-vous des questions pour ce panel ici?
DR. RICHARD: J’en aurai une.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Donc, si vous voulez, peut-être prendre --tu peux prendre la place de M. Stewart?
DR. RICHARD: Je vais parler en anglais
David Amos
David Raymond Amos @DavidRayAmos
Replying to @DavidRayAmos@Kathryn98967631 and 48 others
Methinks Minister Mikey Holland's ears are burning right now or my name ain't "Just Dave" Anyone can Google "Harper and Bankers" if they don't get my jokes about the circus in Fredericton and Ottawa N'esy Pas?
https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2019/05/nb-power-reviving-vexed-smart-meter.html
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/nb-power-smart-meter-application-eub-1.5156867
NB Power reviving vexed smart meter plan less than a year after EUB rejection
54 Comments
Mark (Junkman) George
Content disabled
Screwed enough money out of us to gamble $13 million, and now looking for more?
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Mark (Junkman) George: Methinks you can't say that I didn't warn you N'esy Pas?
Reply to @Mark (Junkman) George: Methinks you can't say that I didn't warn you N'esy Pas?
Mark (Junkman) George
Like hogs feeding at the trough............
The EUB beats those hogs away from the trough, but they are right back trying suck up some more out of us.
David Amos
Reply to @Mark (Junkman) George: I see that you are back as well you after your first comment went "Poof"
David Amos
Surprise Surprise Surprise
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Methinks it was rather obvious that although NB Power and their EUB buddies ignored the concerns of my friend Roger Richard and I, they did not ignore the Irving Clan' wishes N'esy Pas?
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/eub-smart-meters-final-1.4554570
Originally, NB Power produced figures showing the acquisition of smart meters would cost it $122.7 million but generate benefits of only $121.4 million, an overall loss on the investment..
Tuesday, Furey revised those numbers significantly, recasting the project as a clear financial winner.
"There is this additional evidence NB Power has not identified all available benefits," he said.
"NB Power believes that the present value of potential benefits can now be stated to be $154 million."
Furey also took time to reject concerns that smart meters emit an unsafe level of radio frequency emissions.
"It would take years, years, years of exposure to an rf meter to equate to the rf exposure that a person would get from a 10-minute phone call on a cellphone," he said.
Closing arguments on the smart meter plan as well as NB Power's energy-efficiency proposals continue Wednesday morning.
Up first is J.D. Irving Ltd. lawyer Christopher Stewart, who already signalled he was unmoved by Furey's presentation and will be opposing the smart meter purchase.
"We submit that the application for the AMI [smart meter] program be denied," said Stewart shortly before the hearing was adjourned for the day.
"There is not sufficient evidence in the record to allow us, and more importantly you, to draw any other conclusion."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/eub-smart-meters-final-1.4554570
Originally, NB Power produced figures showing the acquisition of smart meters would cost it $122.7 million but generate benefits of only $121.4 million, an overall loss on the investment..
Tuesday, Furey revised those numbers significantly, recasting the project as a clear financial winner.
"There is this additional evidence NB Power has not identified all available benefits," he said.
"NB Power believes that the present value of potential benefits can now be stated to be $154 million."
Furey also took time to reject concerns that smart meters emit an unsafe level of radio frequency emissions.
"It would take years, years, years of exposure to an rf meter to equate to the rf exposure that a person would get from a 10-minute phone call on a cellphone," he said.
Closing arguments on the smart meter plan as well as NB Power's energy-efficiency proposals continue Wednesday morning.
Up first is J.D. Irving Ltd. lawyer Christopher Stewart, who already signalled he was unmoved by Furey's presentation and will be opposing the smart meter purchase.
"We submit that the application for the AMI [smart meter] program be denied," said Stewart shortly before the hearing was adjourned for the day.
"There is not sufficient evidence in the record to allow us, and more importantly you, to draw any other conclusion."
David Amos
Methinks the EUB agrees with me in that the 357 Matter should be settled firsst before NB Power makes another stab and getting Smart Matters N'esy Pas?
These documents can be sourced from the records of the 375 Matter Day 1 of the very long hearing was 02/07/2018
http://www.nbeub.ca/opt/M/browserecord.php?-action=browse&-recid=560
02/09/2018 Hearing - Day 3
Page 601
VICE-CHAIRMAN: I was a bit surprised when I heard this morning and
yesterday that you are entering into a contract at the end of February
and is that with respect to the purchase of the smart meters?
MS. CLARK: That's correct.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: So how can you enter into a contract without the
firm approval of this Board, if we are going to approve or not the
AMI? How prudent is that?
MS. CLARK: So we are at the end stages of the contract in terms of
just the final terms and conditions, but we have been very clear that
we -- with the vendor -- and they recognize that, because we also have
Nova Scotia Power, who is part of our consortium, who also needs Board
approval. So should we not get -- this is conditional on EUB
approval. So should we not get EUB approval, the contract would not
proceed.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Now there was discussion yesterday, I think it was
with Mr. Stoll regarding time of use and time based pricing, and so I
went through the evidence this morning, and in your main evidence, and
I think one of the objective of having the AMI going forward to a time
of use price structure -- rate structure. So am I understanding that
correctly?
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Continued
MS. CLARK: That is correct. And in the evidence, we did answer an
interrogatory on that and you will see that AMI is an enabler for time
varying rates in the Energy Smart NB Plan. And we did have time
varying rates included in our investment rationale. We took it out,
because we couldn't -- we couldn't pinpoint without more detail as to
what those time varying rates may be and the benefit of those, so we
took them out of the investment rationale at this point in time, but
certainly it's something that we are looking at in the future.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: So the fundamental question here is that the Board
should heard -- or hear Matter 357 before approving the AMI? So if we
don't approve time of use, that basically what will happen with your
AMI, I mean it's -- if we don't approve the time of use, which we are
going to hear next year, how can we proceed in approving the AMI
before we look at the rate structure?
MS. CLARK: As we have talked about in our investment rationale,
there are a number of other benefits to both the customer and to the
utility over and above time varying rates that we believe are
important for the utility and for the movement forward of our Energy
Smart New Brunswick plan. Many of those benefits accrue to the
customer. And many of those benefits accrue to the utility and
ultimately the customer. So even if we were not to move in the
direction of time varying rates, we believe that the investment
rationale supports the AMI installation based on the other investment
-- or based on the other benefits that it provides.
MS. CLARK: That is correct. And in the evidence, we did answer an
interrogatory on that and you will see that AMI is an enabler for time
varying rates in the Energy Smart NB Plan. And we did have time
varying rates included in our investment rationale. We took it out,
because we couldn't -- we couldn't pinpoint without more detail as to
what those time varying rates may be and the benefit of those, so we
took them out of the investment rationale at this point in time, but
certainly it's something that we are looking at in the future.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: So the fundamental question here is that the Board
should heard -- or hear Matter 357 before approving the AMI? So if we
don't approve time of use, that basically what will happen with your
AMI, I mean it's -- if we don't approve the time of use, which we are
going to hear next year, how can we proceed in approving the AMI
before we look at the rate structure?
MS. CLARK: As we have talked about in our investment rationale,
there are a number of other benefits to both the customer and to the
utility over and above time varying rates that we believe are
important for the utility and for the movement forward of our Energy
Smart New Brunswick plan. Many of those benefits accrue to the
customer. And many of those benefits accrue to the utility and
ultimately the customer. So even if we were not to move in the
direction of time varying rates, we believe that the investment
rationale supports the AMI installation based on the other investment
-- or based on the other benefits that it provides.
Alex Butt
Yet another way for Mr thomas to make more money for himself and his merry band! When will NB wake up and force the government to put an end to this insanity!
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Butt: Methinks Minister Mikey Holand has plans to his job on or about the 12th of NEVER N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Methinks Minister Mikey Holland's ears are burning right now or my name ain't "Just Dave" Anyone can Google "Harper and Bankers" if they don't get my joke about the circuses in Fat Fred City and Ottawa N'esy Pas?
Jonas Smith
I wouldn't trust NB Power to correctly cost out a grocery list, let alone believe them that they messed up the first time around.
David Amos
Reply to @Jonas Smith: Me Too Furthermore they don't trust us We have to prepay a two month estimate of our upcoming bills before they will even hook us up.
Methinks should be a small wonder why their lawyers have had me illegally barred from the rate increase hearing thus far N'esy Pas?
Methinks should be a small wonder why their lawyers have had me illegally barred from the rate increase hearing thus far N'esy Pas?
Allan J Whitney
They will not stop until NB Power has been sold at ten cents on the dollar to a syndicate of their pals. This will probably happen soon after the coming Gaetan Thomas investment disaster.
David Amos
Reply to @Allan J Whitney: Methinks the Yankees in Emera or the Brits in National Grid would buy NB Power in a heartbeat for KPMG's book value N'esy Pas?
John Valcourt
NB Power should not be allowed to put these in where New Brunswickers DONT WANT THEM. That corporation is owned by the government which means it is owned by tax payers and we should have the say. This is just another way for them to charge more than we can afford for the electricity that we need. There is no way this will save New Brunswickers money. Corporations like this don't try to save us money, they try to bleed every last cent out of us. It has to stop NOW.
David Amos
Awaiting moderation
Reply to @John Valcourt: A little Deja Vu for you https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/eub-hearings-nb-power-smart-meters-1.4529640
Opting out smart meter program could cost NB Power customers
Power customers in British Columbia, Quebec have faced fees for refusing the installation of smart meters
Robert Jones · CBC News · Posted: Feb 10, 2018 8:00 AM AT
"NB Power customers who do not want a smart meter installed on their home could be facing a stiff fee for that decision, but so far the utility is not saying how much it might be.
"It will be based on the principles of cost causation, but we have not gotten into the detail of what that fee would be at this point," said NB Power Senior Vice President of Operations Lori Clark at Energy and Utilities Board hearings on Friday."
Richard Dunn
There have been more than enough reasons to terminate, or not renew, the contract of Gaetan Thomas. NB Power may have a future, but not under his leadership. Please make the necessary changes now.
David Amos
Reply to @Richard Dunn: Dream on
Shawn Tabor
If this is agreed upon, it will be proof in the pudding, that something is very wrong at the top.
David Amos
Reply to @Shawn Tabor: YUP
Trevis L. Kingston
NB Power doesn't need smarter meters... but smarter management and plans.
David Amos
Reply to @Trevis L. Kingston: Oh So True
Dave Ess
How are these idiots still in charge of the utility?
Their first application demonstrated that it would cost more than it would give.
Then they dump a pile of money into unproven scientific hype
Then they're entitled to do it all over again?
I might sound paranoid but I can't see how the new smart meter application won't just be a bunch of cooked numbers to show a "benefit" to the consumer but the reality will be increased rates and revenues to offset the the idiot decision to dump $13 million into cold fusion hype.
David Amos
Reply to @dave ess: "Their first application demonstrated that it would cost more than it would give. Then they dump a pile of money into unproven scientific hype
Then they're entitled to do it all over again?"
Methinks the record shows that the idiots signed a contract to buy a bunch of smart meters without having permission to do so N'ey Pas?
Then they're entitled to do it all over again?"
Methinks the record shows that the idiots signed a contract to buy a bunch of smart meters without having permission to do so N'ey Pas?
Danny Debdee
Reply to @dave ess: it’s not cold fusion. they didn’t put 13 million into it, they put 6.5 from a research and development fund, which is exactly what it is for and government matched the other 6.5
Danny Debdee
Reply to @David Amos: me don’t think so, me thinks most likely these idiots are a lot more informed about the pros and cons then yous, neyyyyy
Shawn McShane
Reply to @Danny Debdee: Whether from NB Power or government it is $13 million of taxpayer money that went to a company where CEO of NB Power is listed as Director in SEC filings in the USA before he gave them the $13 million.
Roger Richard
« During hearings in February 2018, NB Power tried to amend its calculations to boost the benefits of adopting the technology while NB Power president GaëtanThomas gave interviews urging its approval. »
It is worrisome that KPMG is the auditor of NB Power... https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/cra-kmpg-settlement-taxes-1.5154610?__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar&fbclid=IwAR2ZnrhWe_JR6AmwAqt4VcO7BSDTnwmtQQVtZoTd30jtrbQzWQ27m0mBZPg
David Amos
Reply to @Roger Richard: I Concur Kind Sir
David Amos
Reply to @Roger Richard: Here is a little Deja Vu for you and the folks to enjoy
Matter 430
IN THE MATTER OF an application by New Brunswick Power Corporation for approval of the schedules of the rates for the fiscal year commencing April 1, 2019, and other relief as outlined in NB Power’s application
Held at the Algonquin Hotel, St. Andrews, N.B., on May 21st 2019.
Page253
Q. - So Mr. Murphy, just so we are clear then, this annual filing that you are envisioning as part of your DSM deferral account process would not involve a prudency review of those expenses per se, would not ever involve an application to change the ten year deferral period -- or ten year amortization period, excuse me. If those two matters were to become before the Board, it would not be part of this annual compliance filing?
MR. MURPHY: That is correct.
MR. STEWART: Thank you. Those are my questions for this panel, Mr. Chair.
CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Stewart.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Dr. Richard, avez-vous des questions pour ce panel ici?
DR. RICHARD: J’en aurai une.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Donc, si vous voulez, peut-être prendre --tu peux prendre la place de M. Stewart?
DR. RICHARD: Je vais parler en anglais
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Continued
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Mais, écoutez, c’est votre -- si vous voulez parler en française vous avez l’opportunité à faire aussi. Si oui, si vous allez parler en français, peut-être juste me l’indiquer que les personnes peuvent s’aller chercher les écouteurs pis vous écoutez en arrière.
MR. MURPHY: So to that end, perhaps there aren’t any translation devices at the --
VICE-CHAIRMAN: I just asked him, Mr. Murphy. I am not sure if he is going to ask questions in English or in French so --
DR. RICHARD: I will speak English.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: English, okay.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY DR. RICHARD:
Q. - You have a document, Town of Shediac, Smart Grid Pilot Plan. How can I get that document?
MR. MURPHY: Could you direct me to the section of the evidence that you are referring to?
Q. - It is -- it would be in my question number -- I don’t remember the number. It is called Town of Shediac Smart Grid Pilot Plan. My question was --
CHAIRMAN: Excuse me, I think that might be Dr. Richard’s IR-5.
MR. FUREY: So Mr. Chair, while clearly I encourage the panel to respond to this question if they are able to, I do think that Ms. Langlais on Panel B is the witness who would be responsible for this type of documentation and perhaps Dr. Richard’s question would be better asked of Panel B.
CHAIRMAN: So Dr. Richard, Mr. Furey is indicating that the question you have asked, you know, would be better responded to by the next panel that will be up. Is that satisfactory to you to pose that question when Panel B is called?
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Mais, écoutez, c’est votre -- si vous voulez parler en française vous avez l’opportunité à faire aussi. Si oui, si vous allez parler en français, peut-être juste me l’indiquer que les personnes peuvent s’aller chercher les écouteurs pis vous écoutez en arrière.
MR. MURPHY: So to that end, perhaps there aren’t any translation devices at the --
VICE-CHAIRMAN: I just asked him, Mr. Murphy. I am not sure if he is going to ask questions in English or in French so --
DR. RICHARD: I will speak English.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: English, okay.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY DR. RICHARD:
Q. - You have a document, Town of Shediac, Smart Grid Pilot Plan. How can I get that document?
MR. MURPHY: Could you direct me to the section of the evidence that you are referring to?
Q. - It is -- it would be in my question number -- I don’t remember the number. It is called Town of Shediac Smart Grid Pilot Plan. My question was --
CHAIRMAN: Excuse me, I think that might be Dr. Richard’s IR-5.
MR. FUREY: So Mr. Chair, while clearly I encourage the panel to respond to this question if they are able to, I do think that Ms. Langlais on Panel B is the witness who would be responsible for this type of documentation and perhaps Dr. Richard’s question would be better asked of Panel B.
CHAIRMAN: So Dr. Richard, Mr. Furey is indicating that the question you have asked, you know, would be better responded to by the next panel that will be up. Is that satisfactory to you to pose that question when Panel B is called?
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Continued May 22nd 2019.
Page 469
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Dr. Richard, avez-vous des questions pour cette panel?
DR. RICHARD: Oui j’en aurais une ou deux.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Est-ce que vous allez poser vos questions dans la langue Français ou dans la langue Anglais?
DR. RICHARD : En Anglais.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: En Anglais. Si vous voulez avancer, s’il vous plait.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY DR. RICHARD:
Q. - Good afternoon. My first question I would like to have a copy of the document Town of Shediac Smart Grid Pilot Plan?
MS. LANGLAIS: So NB Power does not have a copy of that document to share. We did, since Mr. Richard asked the question yesterday and we were aware that he was looking for that, we did inquire with the Town of Shediac about providing that document and they said that he would need to inquire through the Town of Shediac to I guess obtain that document.
Q. - I already did and they said that I should ask NB Power.
CHAIRMAN: So perhaps you can qualify it for me -- clarify, sorry, your response. I don’t know if you are saying that you don’t have the document or that you can’t share the document. So does NB Power have a copy of that document?
MS. LANGLAIS: It’s my understanding that we do not have a copy of the document
Page 469
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Dr. Richard, avez-vous des questions pour cette panel?
DR. RICHARD: Oui j’en aurais une ou deux.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: Est-ce que vous allez poser vos questions dans la langue Français ou dans la langue Anglais?
DR. RICHARD : En Anglais.
VICE-CHAIRMAN: En Anglais. Si vous voulez avancer, s’il vous plait.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY DR. RICHARD:
Q. - Good afternoon. My first question I would like to have a copy of the document Town of Shediac Smart Grid Pilot Plan?
MS. LANGLAIS: So NB Power does not have a copy of that document to share. We did, since Mr. Richard asked the question yesterday and we were aware that he was looking for that, we did inquire with the Town of Shediac about providing that document and they said that he would need to inquire through the Town of Shediac to I guess obtain that document.
Q. - I already did and they said that I should ask NB Power.
CHAIRMAN: So perhaps you can qualify it for me -- clarify, sorry, your response. I don’t know if you are saying that you don’t have the document or that you can’t share the document. So does NB Power have a copy of that document?
MS. LANGLAIS: It’s my understanding that we do not have a copy of the document
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Continued
Q. - My next question would be have you evaluate the cost of a smart meter that would be wired instead of using WiFi?
MR. CRONKHITE: Sorry, can you repeat your question, I just missed on the first part there?
Q. - You know the cost of the smart meter, we can have a smart meter that is functioning with WiFi, or we can have a smart meter that function being wired with a wire. Have you checked the cost of the wired smart meter?
MR. FUREY: So, Mr. Chair, I struggle to see how this is not anything than other than directly related to an AMI application. I am not sure I can find any link to the current application.
CHAIRMAN: Well, Mr. Furey, only to the extent that some of the expenditures here are in preparation for AMI and I think I will let Dr. Richard’s question at least as far as it has gone, he has asked a very simple question whether or not they have looked at a directly wired device versus a WiFi one. So I would direct the panel if they have a response to that to provide it?
MS. LANGLAIS: So NB Power would have conducted a request for proposal for AMI meters when we were looking at I guess upgrading to the next version of meter and the vendors would have proposed a solution for us, and in those proposals we would not have received anything that would have been I guess a wired meter and not a WiFi meter.
Q. - My next question would be have you evaluate the cost of a smart meter that would be wired instead of using WiFi?
MR. CRONKHITE: Sorry, can you repeat your question, I just missed on the first part there?
Q. - You know the cost of the smart meter, we can have a smart meter that is functioning with WiFi, or we can have a smart meter that function being wired with a wire. Have you checked the cost of the wired smart meter?
MR. FUREY: So, Mr. Chair, I struggle to see how this is not anything than other than directly related to an AMI application. I am not sure I can find any link to the current application.
CHAIRMAN: Well, Mr. Furey, only to the extent that some of the expenditures here are in preparation for AMI and I think I will let Dr. Richard’s question at least as far as it has gone, he has asked a very simple question whether or not they have looked at a directly wired device versus a WiFi one. So I would direct the panel if they have a response to that to provide it?
MS. LANGLAIS: So NB Power would have conducted a request for proposal for AMI meters when we were looking at I guess upgrading to the next version of meter and the vendors would have proposed a solution for us, and in those proposals we would not have received anything that would have been I guess a wired meter and not a WiFi meter.
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Continued
Q. - My next question would be related a little bit to undertaking number 1.
CHAIRMAN: Dr. Richard, I am just going to ask if you might pull that microphone a little bit closer, just not picking up your voice very well, thank you.
Q. - What are the new position for Information Technology Specialist? It is from undertaking number 1 of yesterday morning. And does it relate to smart meters?
MR. CRONKHITE: Sorry, could you repeat your question, please, now that we have the undertaking in front of us?
Q. - Yes. It’s from the undertaking number 1 that was done yesterday. In the response they say that one position is a new position for an Information Technology Specialist. I would like to know if that position is related to smart meters?
MR. CRONKHITE: As indicated in the response, there is two positions related to the AMI infrastructure and one related to Information Technology Specialist. So I do not draw a correlation between the two based on the response.
Q. - Then my other question was what is the Director of Business Development area doing, what is his job?
MR. CRONKHITE: So within my area I have business development and strategic planning. Largely a lot of those activities are within the strategic planning header. Business development activities are conducted within that area. As part of normal operations and as it relates to succession planning, we will have requirements for new staff. And in this particular case, it’s the result of succession planning I believe for retirement.
Q. - My next question would be related a little bit to undertaking number 1.
CHAIRMAN: Dr. Richard, I am just going to ask if you might pull that microphone a little bit closer, just not picking up your voice very well, thank you.
Q. - What are the new position for Information Technology Specialist? It is from undertaking number 1 of yesterday morning. And does it relate to smart meters?
MR. CRONKHITE: Sorry, could you repeat your question, please, now that we have the undertaking in front of us?
Q. - Yes. It’s from the undertaking number 1 that was done yesterday. In the response they say that one position is a new position for an Information Technology Specialist. I would like to know if that position is related to smart meters?
MR. CRONKHITE: As indicated in the response, there is two positions related to the AMI infrastructure and one related to Information Technology Specialist. So I do not draw a correlation between the two based on the response.
Q. - Then my other question was what is the Director of Business Development area doing, what is his job?
MR. CRONKHITE: So within my area I have business development and strategic planning. Largely a lot of those activities are within the strategic planning header. Business development activities are conducted within that area. As part of normal operations and as it relates to succession planning, we will have requirements for new staff. And in this particular case, it’s the result of succession planning I believe for retirement.
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Continued
Q. - And coming back to smart meter, can you provide me a reference where smart meter have reduced the demand in power in other jurisdiction?
MR. CRONKHITE: So that information more specifically I believe would be brought forward as part of the AMI business case in a later proceeding.
Q. - And to make sure, the permission to deploy AMI has to go through Matter 357, is it true?
MR. CRONKHITE: No, I don’t believe that Matter 357 has a direct correlation, or requirement or prerequisite as it relates to AMI infrastructure.
DR. RICHARD: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN: Okay. Just before we call upon the next person for cross-examination, I still want to sort of clarify this issue of the document that Dr. Richard requested with respect to the Town of Shediac.
And he has indicated to us that they told him he should ask NB Power. And the response of this panel is that to your knowledge you don’t have it. But I am going to ask -- and we are going to be back tomorrow -- that you just check and see if you have it. Now you may have it and feel that you are not able to reveal it for whatever reason. There may be some confidentiality issues with respect to it. But it seems strange if they would ask him -- or indicate that he should ask NB Power. I am not suggesting that this panel is aware of it but, you know, overnight perhaps you could check and see if it is a document -- Mr. Furey, perhaps I really should be directing my remarks to you?
MR. FUREY: We will make the appropriate inquiries, Mr. Chair, and report back on that issue.
CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Stoll?
Q. - And coming back to smart meter, can you provide me a reference where smart meter have reduced the demand in power in other jurisdiction?
MR. CRONKHITE: So that information more specifically I believe would be brought forward as part of the AMI business case in a later proceeding.
Q. - And to make sure, the permission to deploy AMI has to go through Matter 357, is it true?
MR. CRONKHITE: No, I don’t believe that Matter 357 has a direct correlation, or requirement or prerequisite as it relates to AMI infrastructure.
DR. RICHARD: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN: Okay. Just before we call upon the next person for cross-examination, I still want to sort of clarify this issue of the document that Dr. Richard requested with respect to the Town of Shediac.
And he has indicated to us that they told him he should ask NB Power. And the response of this panel is that to your knowledge you don’t have it. But I am going to ask -- and we are going to be back tomorrow -- that you just check and see if you have it. Now you may have it and feel that you are not able to reveal it for whatever reason. There may be some confidentiality issues with respect to it. But it seems strange if they would ask him -- or indicate that he should ask NB Power. I am not suggesting that this panel is aware of it but, you know, overnight perhaps you could check and see if it is a document -- Mr. Furey, perhaps I really should be directing my remarks to you?
MR. FUREY: We will make the appropriate inquiries, Mr. Chair, and report back on that issue.
CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Stoll?
NB Power reviving vexed smart meter plan less than a year after EUB rejection
Utility’s initial calculations last year showed costs of smart meters outweigh benefits
· CBC News·
NB Power says it intends on submitting a fresh application for its $100-million plan to install smart meters across the province. (Radio-Canada)
NB Power is ready to take a second run at gaining permission to install smart meters with its 300,000 customers and the plan, which already foundered once at the Energy and Utilities Board, is stirring up controversy again.
"This will be no great surprise to the board, NB Power has indicated that it intends to bring a further application for approval of AMI — late summer, early fall as a rough time frame," said NB Power lawyer John Furey in addressing the EUB earlier this week.
AMI, which stands for Advanced Metering Infrastructure, is a collection of physical and digital upgrades to the electrical grid, including the installation of smart meters that will allow NB Power to collect individual consumption data electronically in real time from customers instead of once a month by a meter reader.
The utility said that will allow for all sorts of pricing and service innovations that the current electrical grid cannot deliver, like offering different electricity prices at different times of the day to match periods of low and high demand.
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NB Power lawyer John Furey, left, said this week the utility will be submitting a new application to install more than 300,000 smart meters with its customers. A similar application was rejected by the EUB last July. (Graham Thompson/CBC)
The conversion is estimated to cost more than $100 million, an amount that requires EUB approval before NB Power can proceed.
Although it has not yet filed an application — or explained why the EUB would agree to a project it rejected less than a year ago — NB Power has already indicated it is planning around a positive decision on smart meters from the EUB by next January.
Based on that expected approval, it asked at this year's rate hearing for permission to spend $1.1 million in preparations for the program.
New Brunswick public intervenor Heather Black found that presumptuous and asked the EUB to reject the $1.1-million smart meter request when it sets NB Power's rates for the year next month.
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New Brunswick public intervenor Heather Black asked the EUB to reject the $1.1-million proposal to begin preparing the smart meter program. (CBC)
"There is still no assurance that the approval (for smart meters) will be given at all, let alone whether it will be given by January 2020," said Black.
NB Power's first attempt to win approval for its smart meter plan was rejected by the EUB last July. It ruled the utility had not presented a convincing case to justify the project's large expense.
"The Board is not satisfied of the prudence of the AMI (smart meter) capital project," read the EUB's 39-page decision.
"Consequently, it is not in the public interest. The fundamental reason behind this conclusion is the Board's finding that no positive business case was established in the evidence."
![]()
New Brunswick's Energy and Utilities Board at NB Power's rate hearing last week in St. Andrews. The board rejected an application by NB Power to install smart meters across the province last year but will soon be asked to rule on the matter again. (Graham Thompson/CBC)
NB Power's original business case showed the costs of smart meters would outweigh benefits by a little over $1 million, a misstep in the application that placed it in immediate trouble.
During hearings in February 2018, NB Power tried to amend its calculations to boost the benefits of adopting the technology while NB Power president GaëtanThomas gave interviews urging its approval.
But in its decision, the board was unconvinced by the rescue attempt and said all the evidence supported the original application's fatal acknowledgement that the cost of adopting smart meters would be higher than the benefits it would generate.
"The demonstrated benefits to ratepayers must outweigh the expected costs that ratepayers will bear," it ruled.
Some critics also argued the meters posed a health hazard because they communicate wirelessly, but the EUB said it could find no evidence of a risk to the public.
NB Power promised to prepare a stronger case for the meters and return to the EUB within 18 months but will likely have to apply by August at the latest to leave enough time for a January decision.
"We won't file until we are ready," said NB Power vice-president Darren Murphy. "If there is some reason we get delayed in that, we will wait until we are ready to file, but certainly we would like to see an application made this year."
CBC's Journalistic Standards and Practices"This will be no great surprise to the board, NB Power has indicated that it intends to bring a further application for approval of AMI — late summer, early fall as a rough time frame," said NB Power lawyer John Furey in addressing the EUB earlier this week.
AMI, which stands for Advanced Metering Infrastructure, is a collection of physical and digital upgrades to the electrical grid, including the installation of smart meters that will allow NB Power to collect individual consumption data electronically in real time from customers instead of once a month by a meter reader.
The utility said that will allow for all sorts of pricing and service innovations that the current electrical grid cannot deliver, like offering different electricity prices at different times of the day to match periods of low and high demand.
NB Power lawyer John Furey, left, said this week the utility will be submitting a new application to install more than 300,000 smart meters with its customers. A similar application was rejected by the EUB last July. (Graham Thompson/CBC)
The conversion is estimated to cost more than $100 million, an amount that requires EUB approval before NB Power can proceed.
Although it has not yet filed an application — or explained why the EUB would agree to a project it rejected less than a year ago — NB Power has already indicated it is planning around a positive decision on smart meters from the EUB by next January.
New Brunswick public intervenor Heather Black found that presumptuous and asked the EUB to reject the $1.1-million smart meter request when it sets NB Power's rates for the year next month.
New Brunswick public intervenor Heather Black asked the EUB to reject the $1.1-million proposal to begin preparing the smart meter program. (CBC)
"There is still no assurance that the approval (for smart meters) will be given at all, let alone whether it will be given by January 2020," said Black.
Fatal acknowledgement
NB Power's first attempt to win approval for its smart meter plan was rejected by the EUB last July. It ruled the utility had not presented a convincing case to justify the project's large expense.
"The Board is not satisfied of the prudence of the AMI (smart meter) capital project," read the EUB's 39-page decision.
"Consequently, it is not in the public interest. The fundamental reason behind this conclusion is the Board's finding that no positive business case was established in the evidence."
New Brunswick's Energy and Utilities Board at NB Power's rate hearing last week in St. Andrews. The board rejected an application by NB Power to install smart meters across the province last year but will soon be asked to rule on the matter again. (Graham Thompson/CBC)
NB Power's original business case showed the costs of smart meters would outweigh benefits by a little over $1 million, a misstep in the application that placed it in immediate trouble.
During hearings in February 2018, NB Power tried to amend its calculations to boost the benefits of adopting the technology while NB Power president GaëtanThomas gave interviews urging its approval.
"The demonstrated benefits to ratepayers must outweigh the expected costs that ratepayers will bear," it ruled.
Some critics also argued the meters posed a health hazard because they communicate wirelessly, but the EUB said it could find no evidence of a risk to the public.
NB Power promised to prepare a stronger case for the meters and return to the EUB within 18 months but will likely have to apply by August at the latest to leave enough time for a January decision.
"We won't file until we are ready," said NB Power vice-president Darren Murphy. "If there is some reason we get delayed in that, we will wait until we are ready to file, but certainly we would like to see an application made this year."